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DRMIZER
12-01-2003, 11:47 AM
We are a nation at war. At war with Iraq, at war with international terrorism, and, sadly, at war with ourselves.

Fully 50 percent of Americans believe we should have never set foot in Iraq while the rest believe, even absent the reasons given for that war, we should be there.

Some on the right accuse critics of the war of virtual treason against the nation, while others on the left believe that, in the words of former Yale chaplain Sloane Coffin; "Dissent is not disloyalty. What is unpatriotic is subservience."

There seems little middle ground in this debate, and I frankly struggle to find moderation in my own outlook that for innumerable reasons we should be in a different place, albeit not too distant from Iraq.

Compare the cost to our fighting men and women in Iraq, besieged, wounded and killed in the original battle and now in guerrilla warfare; the cost to our national treasure; the cost of world respect; then make the comparison and the likely consequence had we put 150,000 of our armed forces into Afghanistan instead of Iraq.

There, with a broad coalition and the unstinting cooperation of peace-loving nations, we could have far more easily brought that country into a 21st century democracy ---- a first step toward opening up the entire Middle East to the advantages of freedom.

The promise of a free Afghanistan nation is now reduced to one city: Kabul. Quickly becoming once again the world's largest supplier of opium, Afghanistan's fields of poppies are surrounded by warlords, violence and corruption. While we send off $80 billion to Iraq, we grant less than $2 billion to Afghanistan. We have failed to deliver on our promise there, just as time may tell we also failed in Iraq.

Iraq might have been next on the military agenda, but had we waited a month or six, the U.N. inspectors might have unequivocally proven, as we now know, that weapons of mass destruction did not exist, making moot the need to go to war.

Yes, Hussein was evil. But he was not alone in the world, as any number of citizens in Serbia or Africa could quickly point out, and an evil dictator is not necessarily an international terrorist. Hussein was an offense to decency but posed no immediate threat to the world.

Instead, into Iraq hell-bent we went, persuaded, as mounting evidence shows, by spin and lies and grand misleading statements from a coterie of exiles and neocons who grabbed the ear of Vice Preisdent Dick Cheney, who in turn inflamed the fervor of an unsophisticated president.

"Bring 'em on," President Bush said, following his glamorous descent to an aircraft carrier where he declared the end to hostilities. And on they came; estimates now range as high as 50,000 of 'em, and no one in the administration will touch a guesstimate of what this will cost us in treasured lives.

Except for those on the front lines, those who lie wounded, those whose families now have nothing left but a dog tag, a picture and a neatly folded flag, we as a nation have been asked to do nothing but go shopping and pledge allegiance to a man who has managed to divide us as no other president in living memory.

That we support our troops cannot be denied, and should never be questioned. When they return, they will be honored and they will have tales to tell and questions to ask. They deserve our ears and our answers.

That we should look with pride and trust to a man who put these men and women at grave risk under false premises, who squandered the good will of nations, to say nothing of lost opportunities, and whose actions have polarized the country, is incomprehensible to me.

Indeed, we are a nation at war.

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2003/11/29/opinion/11_28_0322_06_47.txt

nick
12-01-2003, 05:44 PM
Don't worry about Iraq.You have tens of thousands of homicides each year in the US The biggest threat to Americans on this earth - is other Americans.Most of it is black people killing one another.Something else we are not allowed to talk about.They have managed to kill far more of their own since the civil rights movement than before it.Quite an achievement.

up2date
12-01-2003, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by nick
Don't worry about Iraq.You have tens of thousands of homicides each year in the US The biggest threat to Americans on this earth - is other Americans.Most of it is black people killing one another.Something else we are not allowed to talk about.They have managed to kill far more of their own since the civil rights movement than before it.Quite an achievement. And do you have any stats to back up your claims? Here are the 25 countries with the highest murder rate per capita:

1. Colombia 0.65 per 1000 people
2. South Africa 0.5 per 1000 people
3. Jamaica 0.33 per 1000 people
4. Venezuela 0.33 per 1000 people
5. Russia 0.2 per 1000 people
6. Mexico 0.13 per 1000 people
7. Lithuania 0.1 per 1000 people
8. Estonia 0.1 per 1000 people
9. Latvia 0.1 per 1000 people
10. Belarus 0.1 per 1000 people
11. Ukraine 0.09 per 1000 people
12. Papua New Guinea 0.09 per 1000 people
13. Kyrgyzstan 0.09 per 1000 people
14. Thailand 0.08 per 1000 people
15. Zimbabwe 0.08 per 1000 people
16. Zambia 0.08 per 1000 people
17. Moldova 0.08 per 1000 people
18. Seychelles 0.07 per 1000 people
19. Costa Rica 0.06 per 1000 people
20. Poland 0.06 per 1000 people
21. Georgia 0.05 per 1000 people
22. Uruguay 0.05 per 1000 people
23. United States 0.05 per 1000 people
24. Bulgaria 0.04 per 1000 people
25. Armenia 0.04 per 1000 people
Source: Seventh United Nations Survey of Crime Trends and Operations of Criminal Justice Systems, covering the period 1998 - 2000 (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, Centre for International Crime Prevention)

nick
12-01-2003, 06:18 PM
I am sure that will be a great comfort to the 15,000 Americans killed by their fellow Americans in the last year.

Dissent
12-01-2003, 06:59 PM
Most of you have probably seen ‘Bowling for Columbine’? I found it interesting how Moore pointed out about mainstream media creating this kind of veil of fear about everything because bad news/stereotypes create higher rating. Even Manson pointed this out but about advertising and media – if you’re fat and ugly no one’s going to like and you and you aren’t going to get layed.....so buy this and ppl with like you etc etc.
I could understand if the average American would be afraid of ones’ own shadow and try to buy a pill or cream to fix this ;)

‘A war for oil, a war for gold, a war for money and a war for souls,
A war on terror, a war on drugs, a war on kindness, a war on hugs,
A war on birds and war on bees,
They gotta a war on hippies trying to save the trees,
A war with jets and a war with missles,
A war with high seated government official…..’
(Michael Franti)

Although, this is not just happening in America, the world is at war with it self.