Do you practice the same religion you were raised in?

[DNCAttackDog]

Why or why not?

[MikeD4o7]

grew out of it

[USViking]

I was raised an Episcopalian.

I am now an atheist.

I think the idea of a benvolent God
is incoherent in face of the natural
and self-inflicted calamaties that
human beings have always been exposed to.

[eugene40]

I was raised catholic,, well they tried anyway
BUt I grew out of it,,,, pretty much the same time I figured out there was no santa clause...
Now I am agnostic with leanings towards aetheism.

[Hydrok]

Well, I remain catholic, but I am gonin to keep a sharp eye on our bishops. Each Diosease is its own "Kingdom" only the pope has more power than the bishop. But if he decides to jump on the kill Kerry bandwagon, and starts trying to campain against public schools, I might start to have a problem.

[cpwill]

I was raised an Episcopalian.

I am now an atheist.

I think the idea of a benvolent God
is incoherent in face of the natural
and self-inflicted calamaties that
human beings have always been exposed to.


so you think a loving God would not have given us free will?

[cpwill]

sorta; we're both christian; however, we have differing beliefs within christianity.

[Redheat]

I wasn't raised in organized religion and I don't believe in it today.

So in some ways I guess I was.

[DNCAttackDog]

I was raised Jewish, but I no longer practice Judaism. (I currently attend a Unitarian fellowship.)

I have absolutely nothing against Judaism: in fact, I consider it one of the most "sensible" religions. Unfortunately, all the synagogues in my area place much more emphasis on the rituals than they do on the spirituality and meaning. And ritual means nothing at all to me.

[USViking]

Quote:
Originally Posted by USViking
I was raised an Episcopalian.

I am now an atheist.

I think the idea of a benvolent God
is incoherent in face of the natural
and self-inflicted calamaties that
human beings have always been exposed to.

so you think a loving God would not have given us free will?

cp, my good friend, we have been through
this before.

Briefly, Free Will does not not enter into
any discussion of natural calamities, such
as smallpox. In the past contacting smallpox
depended on the chances of exposure and
immunity only. And an omnipotent benevolent
God would have prevented our exposure.

And if God is omnipotent, then in my opinion
every event is preordained by Him, and there
is no such thing as Free Will, hence Free Will
does not lead to self-imposed calamities.

I do believe in Free Will; to what extent it
has interplay with deterministic elements
of our existence I do not know.

[gopman]

I was raised Catholic am still a practicing member of the RCC.

[Duo_Maxwell]

Nope. Not raised in any religious manner. But now I believe something one could vaguely call voltarish.

[Craig]

Nope. Not raised in any religious manner. But now I believe something one could vaguely call voltarish.

Gasp! An American following the ideas of... a Frenchman? ;) :D

[cpwill]

hey, remember, we do got those calvinists;)

USViking; yes it does; God has to create a neutral existance for us to interact; and this existance can be either harmful or beneficial to us, dependent on circumstances. furthermore, were there no desease; it would in no way be considered benificial; you are not glad that humans are no longer siezed with the unfightable urge to eat our own limbs, because we never have been; it is not an option for yea or nea. furthermore, i contest your theory that desease/death/physical suffering is necessarily a bad thing for humanity.

[Tell me why]

I was raised as a Christian (Lutheran), then fell away from the church for many years. But during the last decade, I have come to understand an appreciate the inherent divinity of Forgiveness. That is why I have once again embraced Christianity, and accepted God's ultimate gift, His Son Jesus Christ.

There is nothing more noble than to forgive. And that is the entire purpose and essence of Christ.

[jamesrage]

I did not grow up in a religious household.We were given a choice to pratice religion on our own,meaning we were not brainwashed as little children but rather my mom let us decide for ourselves rather or not we wanted to be religious,she had no influence in our religious views that we have now.

[Blueangel]

I was raised as a Roman Catholic but am agnostic now.

[Albert]

I was baptized in the United Methodist Church, went to Christian Science Sunday school and am now a convert to the Roman Catholic Church with borderline Gnostic leanings and a strong affection to Tao and the spiritual teachings of the Peacemaker and Handsome Lake.

Yes you could call me :confused: :rolleyes:

[Euripedes]

I was baptized in the United Methodist Church, went to Christian Science Sunday school and am now a convert to the Roman Catholic Church with borderline Gnostic leanings and a strong affection to Tao and the spiritual teachings of the Peacemaker and Handsome Lake.

Yes you could call me :confused: :rolleyes:

Well variety is the spice of life...

[Euripedes]

I prefer not diclose my religion...personal preference...but yes i was raised in the same religion I practice now...my father converted to islam but it doesnt appeal to me...

[Turenne]

I was raised catholic but i didn`t continue with it becuse a,church is ridicoulusly boring b,religion has started so many wars and c,i feel the catholic church is corrupt and i disagree with coiollections and gold items in churches.Worst of all,i feel the catholic church is responsible for destroying the moral values of the bible by its condemnation of different ways of life.

[Phokian]

Born a Catholic, and then after a dispute between my family and a certain church, the majority of us became presbyterian. So, for the most part, I was raised a presbyterian, but have become an atheist.

[Captain America]

I was raised in a Baptist church. Hibbard Memorial in Houston Texas. The pastor there (John Osteen) later was booted out because he got the "Holy Ghost" and started speaking in tongues and his daughter was "faith healed". He later founded "Lakewood Church" and his church be seen today (I think he died though), coast to coast on television.

I was baptised by John Bisagno in the Alto Frio River in Texas, near Garner State Park. I was a youth minister at First Baptist Church in Houston, Texas. I attended Southwest Seminary near Dallas/Fort Worth for three years. I live the life of an Evangelist for many years.

Then I woke up. Logic and reason took over and I was no longer able to convince myself to believe in fairy tales.

So, no. I am NOT practicing the same religion I grew up in.

[Sandy Price]

I was born in a Christian home but never took to it. I gradually discovered I was an Atheist and strangely lost many of my friends for admitting it.

[Redheat]

I've never been into organized religion but I raised my daughter to make up her own mind and she did attend some churches.

However I always thought the baptist black churches looked like the place to be. They were always shown to be singing and dancing and enjoying themselves yelling Amen and letting it all hang out. It's great.

Then you see a mostly white church and everyone is sitting there hands clasped, some heads nodding and complete silence except for the Preacher, minister or Father talking.

When I was a kid I went to a church with a friend from school. They had someone there singing and when they were done I clapped. Well you would have thought I swore! Everyone looked at me like I'd committed a major sin. Didn't get it then and still don't get it now. I mean you feel like clapping what God's going to be pissed off?

[Captain America]

Everyone's an atheist. It just takes a lot of guts to admit it. I propose that if every self-professed christian took a polygraph test and was asked these questions:

1. Did God knock up Mary and she gave birth as a virgin?

2. Did Moses raise a stick and part the seas?

3. Did Jesus get brutally murdered and then rise from the dead three days later?

4. Did the multitudes pig out on four loaves and some fishes?

5. Did Noah get every species of creature known to man on a boat and float around with them for 40 days and 40 nights.

And if they answered "yes." The polygraph would expose them for the hypocrite they are. Seriously, how could ANYBODY truly believe these myths?

[MikeD4o7]

And if they answered "yes." The polygraph would expose them for the hypocrite they are. Seriously, how could ANYBODY truly believe these myths?

Because they've romanticized their own myths so much that they seem immeasurably more plausible than any other myth.

One of my favorite quotes.

"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."
--Stephen F. Roberts

[Euripedes]

Everyone's an atheist. It just takes a lot of guts to admit it. I propose that if every self-professed christian took a polygraph test and was asked these questions:

1. Did God knock up Mary and she gave birth as a virgin?

2. Did Moses raise a stick and part the seas?

3. Did Jesus get brutally murdered and then rise from the dead three days later?

4. Did the multitudes pig out on four loaves and some fishes?

5. Did Noah get every species of creature known to man on a boat and float around with them for 40 days and 40 nights.

And if they answered "yes." The polygraph would expose them for the hypocrite they are. Seriously, how could ANYBODY truly believe these myths?

Because of one factor...most christians believe god to be all-poweful...making seemingly impossible things possible...

in fact the hebrew translation for Yaweh or jehovah (gods name btw) is - he who causes to become. So if you can believe god is all-powerfull and perfect all other things fall into place rather well...

In fact Jesus is also qouted as saying that with God all things are possible...you can check about any translation for that...

No one is asking you to believe but there is a reasonable explanation even if you chose not believe...

[Captain America]

Because of one factor...most christians believe god to be all-poweful...making seemingly impossible things possible...

Yup...that's what they say alright. :rolleyes:

in fact the hebrew translation for Yaweh or jehovah (gods name btw) is - he who causes to become. So if you can believe god is all-powerfull and perfect all other things fall into place rather well...

They also say the rain in Spain falls mainly on the plain. Your point sir?

In fact Jesus is also qouted as saying that with God all things are possible...you can check about any translation for that...

The big bad wolf was quoted that he was going to huff and puff and blow your house down. Are you going to add reinforcement?

No one is asking you to believe but there is a reasonable explanation even if you chose not believe...

Oh there are many reasons to believe I suppose. To some, the fear of death perhaps. Power for another person. Piety and arrogance for another. The need to do good works for another. Bad works for others.

Yes, many reasons to believe. Reason does not always equate with reasonable however. Just my .02

[DNCAttackDog]

Because of one factor...most christians believe god to be all-poweful...making seemingly impossible things possible...
So what's the proper theological response to whether God is able to create a rock so heavy that He Himself can't lift it? :D :D :D

[2ruballa]

You'll see one day. :)

[mahayana]

Tell Me Why, Jesus took it a step further than forgiveness. The proactive message is stated clearly in Luke 6, 20-38. You might take that as a meditation ( it would benefit our Nation's leaders as well). Though I've never been a Christian, I've always admired Jesus for what he was trying to do.

[Euripedes]

So what's the proper theological response to whether God is able to create a rock so heavy that He Himself can't lift it? :D :D :D

Since he is all powerful he could in theory create no object that he was incapable of moving...Thats like another one of his mysteries....If god is eternal...how can we fathom something that has no beggining and no end?

Obviously we simply arent advanced enough to understand God completely, no more then neanderthal man could understand how to build a spaceshuttle...

[DRMIZER]

I was raised in the Evangelical United Brethern Church which eventually joined into the Methodist Church making it "The United Methodist Church."

Dogma is not my bag. I am now a Deist meaning that I believe in a creator of the universe whose bible and existence is evidenced in nature and creation. Universally almost all can agree with this point. Every "organized" religion has it's unique tale about the beginnings, how thus and such must be done in order to "get to where they are going." I fould out that my tale is behind me.

Because of one factor...most christians believe god to be all-poweful...making seemingly impossible things possible..Euripedes, if what you say is true, then why did God use natural laws to create the universe and then, out of the blue, decide to "break his own laws of nature" to make silly things happen as recorded in the bible? That part makes no sense to me whatsoever.


in fact the hebrew translation for Yaweh or jehovah (gods name btw) is - he who causes to become. So if you can believe god is all-powerfull and perfect all other things fall into place rather well...
I believe that anyone or anything that can create a universe is all powerful. That doesn't necessarily indicate he/she/it is interested in "performing" acts recorded in the bible.


In fact Jesus is also qouted as saying that with God all things are possible...you can check about any translation for that...

No one is asking you to believe but there is a reasonable explanation even if you chose not believe
If god DID create the universe (think about it, really) why would he bend laws of nature to perform such magical tricks after the brilliance of creation? There is no reasonable explanation other than......"God works in mysterious ways," which is a saying used by many Christians to explain the unexplainable.

[BFPierce]

I was raised in the Presbyterian church, where my mother and father taught Sunday School and my father was an elder in the church. But as I got older I became disaffected with organized religion, which seemed more intrusive than supportive in the lives of the parishoners. There were simply too many questions in my mind whose answers were "you gotta have faith." I didn't buy it then and I don't buy it now. The answer to how did Moses and Adam both live to be 900 years old is not "God can make anything happen." If so, why did God only seem to make things happen thousands of years ago. Now, I have no quarrel with God, but my beef is with those on earth who claim to speak for him. I consider myself an agnostic.

[Euripedes]

I was raised in the Evangelical United Brethern Church which eventually joined into the Methodist Church making it "The United Methodist Church."

Interesting but expierncing one religion is not tantamount to christian failure....

Dogma is not my bag. I am now a Deist meaning that I believe in a creator of the universe whose bible and existence is evidenced in nature and creation. Universally almost all can agree with this point. Every "organized" religion has it's unique tale about the beginnings, how thus and such must be done in order to "get to where they are going." I fould out that my tale is behind me.

Let me just say that mysterious ways thing is crap:bow ...its used by shallow chrsitians who either cant fathom or can't understand basic biblical doctrine...

Now on to the rest...(cracks knuckles)

Most organized religions change thier teachings and values depending on the age that thier in and who is in power...the trick would to find a religion whos teaching have not been altered by time...or rather a religion that is trying to be as close to its core beliefs not religions that simply insist you adhere puritancal standards and not give you suffecient doctrinal evidence...(if things like abstaining from sex until marriage arent your bag you might wanna steer clear of Christianity and just bypass the whole bible...)

Euripedes, if what you say is true, then why did God use natural laws to create the universe and then, out of the blue, decide to "break his own laws of nature" to make silly things happen as recorded in the bible? That part makes no sense to me whatsoever.

If you are allpowerfull then there is no reason why you cant change the rules as you see fit...the "silly" things you talk about would be no problem for an all-powerful being...the problem is most modern human are so vain and self absorbed with the delusion of science and reason being the only answers, that they discredit god because he doesnt fit thier whims...and besides an almighty force that created everything doesnt nessecarily have to continue monitoring everything...example "God makes it rain" true but true in the fact that he designed the system much like a programmer could say he made a game...in fact he wrote lines of code which allowed the computer to process the lines and create a functional game...

We humans are incapapble of contemplating being all-poweful...it would be like asking ant to contemplate a cell phone...an omniputent,and omnicsient god would not even exist within our own "dimension" which fits with

I believe that anyone or anything that can create a universe is all powerful. That doesn't necessarily indicate he/she/it is interested in "performing" acts recorded in the bible.

If we are created in gods image then I would imagine he cares for us just like a father cares for his children...simply because we dont get struck by lighting when commiting a sin accordingto his law isnt proof of anything. Can a truly loving father force his sons and daughters to respect him and his wishes? Can he force them to love him...of course not...

If god DID create the universe (think about it, really) why would he bend laws of nature to perform such magical tricks after the brilliance of creation? There is no reasonable explanation other than......"God works in mysterious ways," which is a saying used by many Christians to explain the unexplainable.

Again imagine an ant seeing a highrise building ...the ant would have no way to know what or how the building was created and might assume that this is a naturally occuring object with no design..we look into the universe and assume that all of the universe just happened to work out so that we could exist? Laughable... :lol:

No one says you have to worship god, the bible only applies to those who wish to adhere to bible standards...I will not say that without the bible you will die in armegaedon because that would be judging you know wouldnt it? :D

[Euripedes]

I was raised in the Presbyterian church, where my mother and father taught Sunday School and my father was an elder in the church. But as I got older I became disaffected with organized religion, which seemed more intrusive than supportive in the lives of the parishoners. There were simply too many questions in my mind whose answers were "you gotta have faith." I didn't buy it then and I don't buy it now. The answer to how did Moses and Adam both live to be 900 years old is not "God can make anything happen." If so, why did God only seem to make things happen thousands of years ago. Now, I have no quarrel with God, but my beef is with those on earth who claim to speak for him. I consider myself an agnostic.

If humans were created in perfection, then its safe to assume our genes were perfect...that is we could have lived nearly indefinitely...our brains are capapble of holding many more times our current lifespan of memories and facts...The bible records that Adam and eve were punished for disobeying god...and that as a result they would positively die...pretty cut and dry...

now that account can be taken litterally, or figuratively the result is the same...slowly over time the genetic ability for eternal life...would be erased from the gene pool...God was speaking figureativley :shock: he does it all the time...so the descendants of Adam and Eve would retain the ability to live a very long time...

keep swinging guys this is fun... :D

[DRMIZER]

I will not say that without the bible you will die in armegaedon because that would be judging you know wouldnt it? :DGuess that's why we refer to religion as based on faith instead of belief based on reason. You rely on faith. I rely on reason. Which is okay by me. :D

[Euripedes]

Guess that's why we refer to religion as based on faith instead of belief based on reason. You rely on faith. I rely on reason. Which is okay by me. :D

no, i rely on reason, but i understand that mankinds reasoning is not absolute and that no one alive now has even close to all the answers....Faith is a relative term I like the words hope and logic better...

[NetxMan]

I was raised in a a very strong christian family, my father was a minister. We had bible readings every breakfast and dinner, went to church 3 times a week.

I don't go to church now, and haven't in years. But I do send my children to church and raise them how I was raised without the Bible and Jesus in every other sentence. I don't know what I believe anymore, but I do know that if you live your life and raise your family using the core christian values you can't really go wrong.

I think that my parents stretched some things, but they instilled some of the best values in me a human should have. Something I think is missing from family's now a days.

Do I believe there is a God, A higher power, a Supreme being? Yes

[Captain America]

Mumbo, jumbo, gobbledy-gook.

As for me and my house, we shall serve logic and the dictates of reason.

[The Big Bog]

Was raised as a Methodist.

Have no idea what I believe now. I don't think human beings were designed at this stage in our evolutionary journey to quite understand the concept of a higher power yet.

So I'll just follow the Golden Rule for now.

Although many elements of Buddhism intrigue me. :Peace:

[NetxMan]

Mumbo, jumbo, gobbledy-gook.

As for me and my house, we shall serve logic and the dictates of reason.

If you were referring to my post, then we agree. Although you would probably argue it because I used the words "Christian Values," we do agree.

[Captain America]

I don't discriminate. The idea of 70 virgins in heaven is just as rediculous to me as someone turning water into wine. All these ancient fairy tale religions are gobbley-gook to me.

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck.......

[DRMIZER]

no, i rely on reason, but i understand that mankinds reasoning is not absolute and that no one alive now has even close to all the answers....Faith is a relative term I like the words hope and logic better...Thank you. I too forgot the word logical in my response.

[MikeD4o7]

If humans were created in perfection, then its safe to assume our genes were perfect...that is we could have lived nearly indefinitely...our brains are capapble of holding many more times our current lifespan of memories and facts...The bible records that Adam and eve were punished for disobeying god...and that as a result they would positively die...pretty cut and dry...

now that account can be taken litterally, or figuratively the result is the same...slowly over time the genetic ability for eternal life...would be erased from the gene pool...God was speaking figureativley he does it all the time...so the descendants of Adam and Eve would retain the ability to live a very long time...

keep swinging guys this is fun...


I suppose you could still claim that is somehow possible... but realize that it does rely on the process of cell replication being completely different now than it was back then. Because of the process, chromosones become shorter with each replication cycle.. eventually genes we need to survive are literally lost. Because of this property, people haev a maximum lifespan... and it's under 200 years.

[Euripedes]

"Because of this property, people haev a maximum lifespan... and it's under 200 years."

The bible allows for the earth to be millions of years old...it attribute creation to be in 7 days that could 7 days means 7 eons we really dont know, this ill admit but jez we are dealing with an eternal Being here...if true it makes possible many things...including sustained life...we know that human growth stops in the early 30's we also know tht if thier was a gene for eternal life...it must have been lost or removed (logic since we cant live forever) since we simply have no real way to carbon date accurately any human remains over 10,000 to within anything more the 2 to three hundred years we have no way knowing how long they may have lived we only have ourselves a "piss" poor comparison to make. We dont really no what those first few generations of humans were really like...

Its possible god used the process of evolution to mold and shape our speices like a claymaker with clay widdling out the bad and leaving the good by manipulating our genes... I cant back that up scripturally accept a quote in psalms that says all our parts were down in writing before our birth...but its not outside the realm of possibility...

Just some conjecture but fascinating to contemplate...

[cpwill]

it said He made humans out of dust; it didn't say how.

[MikeD4o7]

The bible allows for the earth to be millions of years old...it attribute creation to be in 7 days that could 7 days means 7 eons we really dont know, this ill admit but jez we are dealing with an eternal Being here...if true it makes possible many things...including sustained life...we know that human growth stops in the early 30's we also know tht if thier was a gene for eternal life...it must have been lost or removed (logic since we cant live forever) since we simply have no real way to carbon date accurately any human remains over 10,000 to within anything more the 2 to three hundred years we have no way knowing how long they may have lived we only have ourselves a "piss" poor comparison to make. We dont really no what those first few generations of humans were really like...

Its possible god used the process of evolution to mold and shape our speices like a claymaker with clay widdling out the bad and leaving the good by manipulating our genes... I cant back that up scripturally accept a quote in psalms that says all our parts were down in writing before our birth...but its not outside the realm of possibility...

Just some conjecture but fascinating to contemplate...


I realize you could easily argue that it's possible... it's just that it would literally take some kind of sustained miracle, it wouldn't be as simple as an evolutionary process or somehow removing a particular gene or anything else that would be considered a natural occurence. It would have to be a fundamental difference in the way that cells, one of the most basic building blocks of human life, reproduce. It would require a complete reexamination of scientific biological history.

[Euripedes]

"It would require a complete reexamination of scientific biological history."

Im fairly unconvinced it would even show up in the rexamination...how do you look for a gene thats been removed from an entire species?

[Euripedes]

it'd be like a caveman like looking for the missing bolt from the empire statebuilding...

[MikeD4o7]

"It would require a complete reexamination of scientific biological history."

Im fairly unconvinced it would even show up in the rexamination...how do you look for a gene thats been removed from an entire species?


Well that's what I'm saying... there's no way that the presence of any gene would change it... it comes down to cell production on a fundamental level.

[Euripedes]

Really th only thing the cell would need is a gene re affirming the celluar regneration like we have at birth...our body is capable of living for an indefinite period...the problem is our genes seem to conk out at age 30...Scientist still dont have an answer why...and i suspect their is more at work then just some random genes...

[MikeD4o7]

To be honest with you I'm gonna have to get back to you on this. I was basing my argument around what I had learned from my girlfriend. When it was initially explained to me though, it came across that we know very well why the genes conker out, and it's due to what's genetic information is inevitably lost with each cyclical reproduction. I'll try to get a detailed account of how it works and get back to you.

[DRMIZER]

So what's the proper theological response to whether God is able to create a rock so heavy that He Himself can't lift it? :D :D :DI have the theological answer. . . . . .He could if he wanted to.

[DNCAttackDog]

I have the theological answer. . . . . .He could if he wanted to.
From which it follows that God is not omnipotent. Simple logic. :shrug:

[cpwill]

not really, the question itself is contradictory.

[DNCAttackDog]

Dang nabbit, CP, do I have to spell everything out for you!? :(

You got two options, here:

a) God can't create the rock; therefore, He's not omnipotent. It's something he can't do.
or
b) God can create the rock, but He can't lift it; therefore He's not omnipotent. Lifting the rock is something he can't do.

No contradictions, no paradoxes, no nuthin'.

Do I have to draw you a picture?