Christian study finds massive shift away from Christianity

[Groucho]

OK, my title simplifies it, but it's hard to summarize a study in one line properly.

The study (http://www.barna.org/FlexPage.aspx?Page=BarnaUpdate&BarnaUpdateID=280) found this:

As the nation’s culture changes in diverse ways, one of the most significant shifts is the declining reputation of Christianity, especially among young Americans. A new study by The Barna Group conducted among 16- to 29-year-olds shows that a new generation is more skeptical of and resistant to Christianity than were people of the same age just a decade ago.

The study shows that 16- to 29-year-olds exhibit a greater degree of criticism toward Christianity than did previous generations when they were at the same stage of life. In fact, in just a decade, many of the Barna measures of the Christian image have shifted substantially downward, fueled in part by a growing sense of disengagement and disillusionment among young people. For instance, a decade ago the vast majority of Americans outside the Christian faith, including young people, felt favorably toward Christianity’s role in society. Currently, however, just 16% of non-Christians in their late teens and twenties said they have a "good impression" of Christianity.

More at the link, of course.

Mostly this seems to be a disillusionment of organized Christian religion in general, from what I read -- they see it as hypocritical, too political, and "not what Jesus preached about."

We may be seeing the rapid decline of the religious right...

[Groucho]

Oh, and here's an interesting quote:

David Kinnaman, who is a 12-year-veteran of the Barna team, pointed out some of the unexpected findings of the research. "Going into this three-year project, I assumed that people’s perceptions were generally soft, based on misinformation, and would gradually morph into more traditional views. But then, as we probed why young people had come to such conclusions, I was surprised how much their perceptions were rooted in specific stories and personal interactions with Christians and in churches. When they labeled Christians as judgmental this was not merely spiritual defensiveness. It was frequently the result of truly ‘unChristian’ experiences. We discovered that the descriptions that young people offered of Christianity were more thoughtful, nuanced, and experiential than expected."

[Izdaari]

I can't argue with those results, because I'd make many of the same criticisms myself.

[Groucho]

What is amazing is how sharp the shift is in just a dozen years or so.

[serenity]

What is amazing is how sharp the shift is in just a dozen years or so.


Honestly, I would have guessed the opposite!

But then, godzilla help me, I'm not too bright.

[Izdaari]

But see, the thing is, it isn't Christ the kids are down on: it's the hypocritical, judgmental Christians and their Churchianity. Churches that do it right, the way Jesus would want, are probably doing very well. Certainly my church is. That's as it should be: the wheat will prosper, the tares will fall by the wayside.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_Tares

[Izdaari]

bump, and testing too - site performance issues

[steveksux]

bump, and testing too - site performance issuesSte performance issues.... or the wrath of God.. Perhaps Jesus not pleased with this thread???

;)

Randy

[Dangerrmouse]

Or perhaps Cernunnus. ;)

[Izdaari]

Ste performance issues.... or the wrath of God.. Perhaps Jesus not pleased with this thread???

;)

Randy
:p

I think Jesus would be fine with it. He's all about the truth, and how it'll set us free. Nobody knows better than God that the biggest obstacle to the acceptance of His message is the bad behavior of His followers.

As for the site performance issues, it seems that if I post anything around 1am PST, it takes forever, sometimes resulting in multiple accidental double posts.

[halfamind]

Honestly, I would have guessed the opposite!

But then, godzilla help me, I'm not too bright.

If it takes my strapping myself into a big rubber suit, stomping on a few Japanese skyscrapers and grappling with gargantuan, mutant moths connected telepathically with a pair of female pixies, I am prepared to disabuse you of these notions.

BTW -- have you ever noticed the similarity between godzilla movies and professional wrestling? One movie, he's a bad guy, the next movie he's good. I think there is a heuristic to be extracted from this that might even go so far as explain Christianity's popularity or lack thereof, but I find myself not quite up to the task.

[steveksux]

:p

I think Jesus would be fine with it. He's all about the truth, and how it'll set us free. Nobody knows better than God that the biggest obstacle to the acceptance of His message is the bad behavior of His followers.Agreed. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to deduce all the high profile psuedo-Christians caught in scandals lately will have a backlash of some sort. From my experience the young are most susceptable to reactions to hypocrisy. People tend to develop an immunity to it as they grow older...

Randy

[rjamortega]

I made the same point on that other thread, but some of the "less-than-conservatives" didn't think I was correct. It makes sense to me as I see it in my own two kids.

[AgentM]

I'm not really surprised. Back in my grandfathers day, practically everybody was religious it seems. Now, at least where I live, hearing that somebody is say a fundamentalist Christian is considered unusual and many are non-religious. It depends on where you live though, obviously. A friend of mine from Alberta tells me that most of his friends back there are quite religious.

[steveksux]

If it takes my strapping myself into a big rubber suit, stomping on a few Japanese skyscrapers and grappling with gargantuan, mutant moths connected telepathically with a pair of female pixies, I am prepared to disabuse you of these notions.
.Speaking of rubber suits, please be careful, don't want to end up like this guy... ;) The pastor meme seems particularly apropos given the thread...

Pastor found in wet suits after autoerotic mishap (http://clipmarks.com/clipmark/D5D98092-7F75-41EA-8B00-77CA307482BE/)

Randy

[halfamind]

Speaking of rubber suits, please be careful, don't want to end up like this guy... ;) The pastor meme seems particularly apropos given the thread...

Pastor found in wet suits after autoerotic mishap (http://clipmarks.com/clipmark/D5D98092-7F75-41EA-8B00-77CA307482BE/)

Randy

Just for that, I am not going to share with you the patent information on my latest invention -- the orgasmisuit.

[steveksux]

Just for that, I am not going to share with you the patent information on my latest invention -- the orgasmisuit.

Sorry, the rubber suit comment proved too tempting a segue into that story for me to resist....

Randy

[serenity]

If it takes my strapping myself into a big rubber suit, stomping on a few Japanese skyscrapers and grappling with gargantuan, mutant moths connected telepathically with a pair of female pixies, I am prepared to disabuse you of these notions.


Ha! So now you’ve twice caught me in professing self-effacement re. my own intelligence. I’m going to lay off, because I don’t want you to suspect a “protest too much” aspect to this.


BTW -- have you ever noticed the similarity between godzilla movies and professional wrestling? One movie, he's a bad guy, the next movie he's good. I think there is a heuristic to be extracted from this that might even go so far as explain Christianity's popularity or lack thereof, but I find myself not quite up to the task.

I hadn’t noticed, but you’re right. As to the task you’ve described…right, this sort of thoughtful discernment of popular culture, while hugely interesting, takes some real work if we’re to get past the bland, surface activity. You know, like, “Are horror movies reactionary or liberal”? (Stephen King says, “both,” and I presume he’s thought about it at some length.) What, if anything, does “Pulp Fiction” say about the navigation between lowbrow “entertainment” and “art”?

What does Godzilla have to say about religious Faith?

I have no clue, and no clue, and I don’t know. But the questions are interesting anyway.

[Groucho]

I'm not really surprised. Back in my grandfathers day, practically everybody was religious it seems. Now, at least where I live, hearing that somebody is say a fundamentalist Christian is considered unusual and many are non-religious. It depends on where you live though, obviously. A friend of mine from Alberta tells me that most of his friends back there are quite religious.

There was another study done recently that showed that something like 20% or more of the public considered themselves completely non-religious or "rational." (Bill Mahr did a great bit on this.) That is also a huge jump. There are more people who consider themelves atheist or agnostic than there are Jews or Mormons or any number of other smaller religious groups ...

... but that's something for another topic, I guess.

[serenity]

There was another study done recently that showed that something like 20% or more of the public considered themselves completely non-religious or "rational." (Bill Mahr did a great bit on this.) That is also a huge jump. There are more people who consider themelves atheist or agnostic than there are Jews or Mormons or any number of other smaller religious groups ...


Also, my understanding is that a lot of people who are nominally “Christian” aren’t actually BELIEVERS, per se, when it comes down to it. They grew up Christian, they never go to church, and if pushed, they will say, “Well, I don’t really know if there’s a God or not”…which is agnosticism, edging towards atheism. Even if they don’t define themselves as such at the moment.

[Ethos]

I would be interested to see the numbers broken down by region and population. My guess would be the shift is smaller in rural environments where homogenity is still relatively strong and larger (and perhaps accelerating) in areas that were once small towns, but have either absorbed into larger urban landscapes or scattered to nearby cities.

Ethos

[lord tammerlain]

I'm not really surprised. Back in my grandfathers day, practically everybody was religious it seems. Now, at least where I live, hearing that somebody is say a fundamentalist Christian is considered unusual and many are non-religious. It depends on where you live though, obviously. A friend of mine from Alberta tells me that most of his friends back there are quite religious.

I hang around the wrong crowds apparently. I know of only 2 younger people who attend christian worship services.

The many churches around my home usually are attended by mostly the elderly.

Only some of the evanglical style churhes have a number of younger Calgarians. But again I perfer to hang with the sinner types

[AgentM]

I hang around the wrong crowds apparently. I know of only 2 younger people who attend christian worship services.

The many churches around my home usually are attended by mostly the elderly.

Only some of the evanglical style churhes have a number of younger Calgarians. But again I perfer to hang with the sinner types

Well my friend is from Medicine Hat. I imagine the situation is quite different in more urban areas like Calgary. The urban-rural split again. The situation you describe in Calgary is similar to that of Victoria, my city. Here most of the churches population is made of the elderly from what I've observed, and most of that population is dwindling. Churches are closing down or merging to make ends meet.

[Dangerrmouse]

Nobody dwindles like the elderly! (Do they do it before or after church?)

[Izdaari]

Well, I'm a hardcore born-again Christ follower, but I'm not "religious"; that is, I don't buy into the American Christian subculture (which is a sociological thing, nothing to do with God one way or another) or into Churchianity, Bibliolatry or Legalism (IMO all three are heresies).

Oh, and the church service I go to is mostly young people... and I'm pretty sure there are few nominal Christians among them; this crowd seems to mean it. And I've noticed, over the few months I've been here, the attendence keeps increasing. We must be doing something right.

[AgentM]

Well, I'm a hardcore born-again Christ follower, but I'm not "religious"; that is, I don't buy into the American Christian subculture (which is a sociological thing, nothing to do with God one way or another) or into Churchianity, Bibliolatry or Legalism (IMO all three are heresies).

Oh, and the church service I go to is mostly young people... and I'm pretty sure there are few nominal Christians among them; this crowd seems to mean it. And I've noticed, over the few months I've been here, the attendence keeps increasing. We must be doing something right.

Seems that your church's situation is an exception to the norm.

[Izdaari]

Seems that your church's situation is an exception to the norm.
Aye, but it isn't our situation that's different from other churches in the same part of town that aren't doing as well. What's different is our actions. What we're doing that's working is stuff that any Christian church could and should do. That may be easier said than done, because part of it is good leadership, and that isn't always easy to come by... but God isn't just about the easy stuff.

:angel:

[lawman]

Also, my understanding is that a lot of people who are nominally “Christian” aren’t actually BELIEVERS, per se, when it comes down to it. They grew up Christian, they never go to church, and if pushed, they will say, “Well, I don’t really know if there’s a God or not”…which is agnosticism, edging towards atheism. Even if they don’t define themselves as such at the moment.
Good point. A lot of people in America tend to think of religion as something hereditary... not to the explicit extent of Judaism, perhaps, but in a more unexamined sense: if they were "brought up" as Christians, then that's what they'll say they are, whether or not they still actually worship or believe.

One hopes to see this sort of thinking diminish over time. Among other things, it's quite a burden on kids who are independent-minded enough to not want to be associated with their parents' belief system... apparently a growing number, as this very thread indicates.

[AgentM]

There was another study done recently that showed that something like 20% or more of the public considered themselves completely non-religious or "rational." (Bill Mahr did a great bit on this.) That is also a huge jump. There are more people who consider themelves atheist or agnostic than there are Jews or Mormons or any number of other smaller religious groups ...

... but that's something for another topic, I guess.

From Statistics Canada's info, from our 2001 Census, 4.9 million out of 29 million (that particular census is a bit old now, Canada's population is up to 32 million) had no religious affiliation. I think that's about 16.5% of the population. http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/demo30a.htm

It'll be interesting to see what the numbers are from the 2006 Census.

[::Major_Baker::]

this is no surpirse. As time goes on people will begin to see the light.

[TomAZ]

Religion is a business, nothing more, nothing less. (been there, done that.).
In this area of north-central AZ. the churches have as many TV commercials as the used-car business.

[::Major_Baker::]

Religion is a business, nothing more, nothing less. (been there, done that.).
In this area of north-central AZ. the churches have as many TV commercials as the used-car business.

What makes you say that?
http://glennhager.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/megachurch.jpg

[TomAZ]

What makes you say that?
http://glennhager.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/megachurch.jpg



BINGO!!!