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DRMIZER
11-17-2003, 11:01 PM
The following is the complete letter in which Thomas Jefferson used the term "separation of Church and State." The Deistic references to God as "the common Father" and "Creator of man" are similar to those Thomas Jefferson used in the Declaration of Independence. Nowhere can be found references to the Judeo-Christian gods. Following the letter are more qoutes from Jefferson that show his strong desire to keep religion and government completely separate.


January 1, 1802

The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good to express towards me on behalf of the Danbury Baptist Association give me the highest satisfaction.
My duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of my constituents, and in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more pleasing.

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislative should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church and State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection and blessing of the common Father and Creator of man, and tender you for yourselves and your religious association, assurances of my high respect and esteem.

I would like to thank Dr. Robert Wolsch of the Thomas Jefferson Society for bringing the above letter to my attention. The Thomas Jefferson Society can be contacted at: 181 White St., Box 1776, Danbury, CT 06810. The editor.

"Whenever, therefore, preachers, instead of a lesson in religion, put them off with a discourse on the Copernican system, on chemical affinities, on the construction of government, or the characters or conduct of those administering it, it is a breach of contract, depriving their audience of the kind of service for which they are salaried, . . . In choosing our pastor we look to his religious qualifications, without inquiring into his physical or political dogmas, with which we mean to have nothing to do. . . ."
The above is taken from a letter from Thomas Jefferson to P.H. Windover written at Monticello, March 13, 1815

"Reason and free inquiry are the only effectual agents against error. Give a loose to them, they will support the true religion by bringing every false one to their tribunal, to the test of their investigation. They are the natural enemies of error, and of error only. Had not the Roman government permitted free inquiry, Christianity could never have been introduced."

"I doubt whether the people of this country would suffer an execution for heresy, or a three years imprisonment for not comprehending the mysteries of the Trinity. But is the spirit of the people an infallible, a permanent reliance? Is it government? . . . Besides, the spirit of the times may alter, will alter. Our rulers will become corrupt, our people careless. A single zealot may commence persecutor, and better men be his victims."
The above two qoutes are taken from Jefferson's NOTES ON VIRGINIA, QUERY XVII, The Different Religions Received into that State

cpwill
11-18-2003, 01:56 AM
"I am sure there never was a people who had more reason to acknowledge a Divine Interposition in their affairs than those of the United States."
-George Washington, March 11, 1792

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this Great Nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ."
-Patrick Henry

"Of all the Dispositions and Habits which lead to political prosperity, Religion and Morality are indespensable supports. It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

"Our Constitution was made only for a Moral and Religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
-John Adams

"A Bible and a newspaper in every house, a good school in every district-all studied and appreciated as they merit-are the principle support of virtue, morality, and civil liberty."
-Ben Franklin

"No people ought to feel greater Obligations to Celebrate the Goodness of the Great Disposer of events and the Destiny of Nations than the people of the United States... and to the same Divine Author of every good and perfect givet we are indebted for all those privileges and advantages, Religious as well as Civil, which are so richly enjoyed in this favored land."
-James Madison

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty adn the pursuit of happiness."
-the Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America

Diogenes
11-18-2003, 03:15 AM
Most of the colonies were founded not by people seeking freedom of religion, but by groups seeking to establish their own religious tyranny. The only way to unite all the colonies was to generally acknowledge religion as far as it was common to all colonies ("In God We Trust", "God save this court", etc) and, beyond that, make it clear that no one sect was going to dictate public policy. In the context of the times, Jefferson was right on target and it is unfortunate that his wisdom has lately been perverted to ban all religious expression in public life. But it's a great subject for those who find the Ten Commandments too restrictive.

DRMIZER
11-18-2003, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by cpwill
"I am sure there never was a people who had more reason to acknowledge a Divine Interposition in their affairs than those of the United States."
-George Washington, March 11, 1792

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this Great Nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ." -Patrick Henry

"Of all the Dispositions and Habits which lead to political prosperity, Religion and Morality are indespensable supports. It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

"Our Constitution was made only for a Moral and Religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
-John Adams

"A Bible and a newspaper in every house, a good school in every district-all studied and appreciated as they merit-are the principle support of virtue, morality, and civil liberty."
-Ben Franklin

"No people ought to feel greater Obligations to Celebrate the Goodness of the Great Disposer of events and the Destiny of Nations than the people of the United States... and to the same Divine Author of every good and perfect givet we are indebted for all those privileges and advantages, Religious as well as Civil, which are so richly enjoyed in this favored land."
-James Madison

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty adn the pursuit of happiness."
-the Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America

George Washington was a professed Deist. Simply because he made reference to the Bible does not disqualify him as a Deist. Many Deists have beliefs rooted in the Christian Religion but do not call themselves Christians.

Patrick Henry, as we all know now, was wrong with this insight. No reference of any kind was made in the Declaration of Independence to Christianity. . . .no in the Constitution of the United States. Isn't a Christian a religionist?


John Adams was a professed Deist. So was James Madison.

Ben Franklin I do not know what he professed.

The point made is that
1) This nation was not built on Christianity as I have heard so many misinformed preachers proclaim.

2) This nation was built to escape religious persecution, hence the lack of reference to "Christianity, New, Old Testiments, Christ, Moses, 10 Commandments, etc. in the official documents founding the US.

I am sure many quotes can be found from the founding fathers regarding God, morality, etc. . . . .and, sometimes in a personal sense to Christianity. However, one would be hard pressed to find any official communicaqtion re: any particular religion.